Rethinking Hell

Pastor Douglas Wilson, critic of conditional immortality, joins Rethinking Hell contributor Chris Date to discuss his objections to belief in the final annihilation of the unsaved. Promoted Resources Doug Wilson’s blog, “Blog and Mablog”: http://www.dougwils.com/ The church at which Doug pastors: http://www.christkirk.com/ Podcast Outline 00:00 Intro Music 00:53 Chris Date Introduces the episode 01:49 Transition Music 02:05 Intro of Pastor Douglas Wilson of Christ Church in Moscow, Idaho 03:45 Areas of passion: “All of Christ, for all of life, for all the world” (Integrated Faith) 05:20 On debates and friendship with Christopher Hitchens 07:15 On dealing with hostility from Bloomington students 08:50 (Wilson) Christians and the sin of “shrillness” 09:45 Hell a hot topic 10:20 Can the nature of the discussion improve? 13:43 Can you summarize your view on hell? 14:40 (Wilson) Dante a work of art, not a blueprint for hell 15:00 (Wilson) “It’s bad and it’s forever.” 15:49 (Wilson) Open to discuss C.S. Lewis’ view in The Problem of Pain 17:38 Problems with the Lewis view 19:42 Seven Reasons Why we Cannot Water Down the Lake of Fire 20:33 The “Infinite Sin” argument 21:15 (Wilson) Flip it: Can a finite being do anything infinite? 22:18 Where do you locate Annihilationism on the acceptability spectrum? 25:01 Doug Wilson on Bell and Hell (YouTube video) 26:15 Annihilationism a variation of Universalism? 28:39 Wilson’s exchange with Andrew Perriman 34:10 Wilson’s 3 concerns with Annihilationism 34:28 Concern #1: Annihilation is just what Siddhartha wanted 36:56 Date responds to concern #1 38:30 Wilson interacts with Date’s response 41:01 Concern #2: Justice and Annihilationism 43:14 Wilson talks to this second of his concerns 45:30 Concern 2.5 (?): Degrees of Punishment 52:15 Concern #3: Consensus throughout Church History 55:25 Date responds 58:00 Wilson interacts with Date’s response 62:20 Wrapping Up: Parting Message from Wilson 63:30 Where to find Pastor Wilson online 64:10 Outro Music 64:19 Chris Date closes the episode 64:50 Closing theme music

 Christian philosopher Jeff Cook joins Rethinking Hell contributor Joshua Anderson to discuss conditionalism and his recent book, Everything New. Promoted Resources The website for Everything New: http://everythingnew.org/ The church at which Jeff pastors: http://www.whatisatlas.com/ The philosophy department of UNC where Jeff lectures: http://www.unco.edu/philosophy/ Podcast Outline 00:00 Intro Music 00:53 Chris Introduces the episode 01:40 Joshua intro to the guest, Jeff Cook 02:52 Origin of Cook’s interest in philosophy / his education 05:27 Cook’s writing: starting with article “Repainting Hell“ 08:20 Applying Cook’s definition of “orthodoxy” to the doctrine of hell 10:00 Rob Bell consistent on hell; he believes in it 10:58 Pluralism a “dead option,” but four others still available 11:15 “Universalism” used in two ways: Soteriology and a theory of reality (pluarlism) 13:15 Hell as rehabilitation (Rob Bell’s view?) 14:12 Function of Hell in Universalistic views 14:54 Cook’s view: Annihilationism (Function = Destruction) 16:30 On to the Book: Everything New, by Jeff Cook 21:05 Hell an “anti-creation” 23:15 Traditional hell does not fit as well into big picture 24:35 Atheist view actually more Biblical than tradition? A charming feature, says Cook. 26:10 Traditionalism an [unnecessary] hindrance to unbelievers/atheists 28:15 Annihilationism: Rescue Plan instead of Fear Factor 31:48 Christians get bad name because of the traditional view of hell 32:20 Heaven should not be viewed in escapist terms 39:00 Real eschatalogical trajectory (judgment *will* occur) 41:03 Wrap up by Joshua 41:42 Outro Music 41:50 Chris closes the episode and reads 3 reviews (2 good / 1 bad) from iTunes

Dr. Glenn Peoples joins fellow RethinkingHell.com contributor Chris Date to discuss his open letter to traditionalists, and some of the reasons traditionalists are losing the battle over the doctrine of hell.   Promoted Resources Dr. Glenn Peoples’ blog “An open letter to my traditionalist friends”

Rethinking Hell contributor Chris Date answers common traditional objections to conditional immortality and the final annihilation of the unsaved.    Sources Cited Peterson, Robert A.; Fudge, Edward W. (2010-09-15). Two Views of Hell: A Biblical & Theological Dialogue (pp. 88-89). Intervarsity Press – A. Kindle Edition. Christopher W. Morgan, “Annihilationism: Will the Unsaved be Punished Forever?” in Christopher W. Morgan and Robert A. Peterson (ed), Hell Under Fire: Modern Scholarship Reinvents Eternal Punishment (Grand Rapids: Zondervan, 2004), 217. “Aubade,” read by Philip Larkin Plutarch, edited by Goodwin, W. Plutarch’s Morals. “That it is not possible to live pleasurably according to the doctrine of Epicurus.” Glenn Peoples, “Why I am an Annihilationist”

Part two of Chris Date’s discussion with Dr. Preston Sprinkle, co-author of Erasing Hell with Francis Chan, to discuss why, though finding himself now leaning toward conditionalism, a few passages still give him pause.   Promoted Resources Preston Sprinkle’s website Preston on Twitter Preston on Facebook Eternity Bible College where Preston teaches Erasing Hell at Amazon.com (also available on Kindle) Ronnie’s review of Erasing Hell at http://conditionalism.net/blog Related Posts “Punishment” and the Polysemy of Deverbal Nouns Consistency in Preterism: Annihilation and Revelation 20:10 Traditionalism and the (Not So) Second Death

Dr. Preston Sprinkle, co-author of Erasing Hell with Francis Chan, joins RethinkingHell.com contributor Chris Date to discuss why, having leaned toward the traditional view of hell when the book was published, he now finds himself leaning toward conditionalism.   Promoted Resources Preston Sprinkle’s website Preston on Twitter Preston on Facebook Eternity Bible College where Preston teaches Erasing Hell at Amazon.com (also available on Kindle) Ronnie’s review of Erasing Hell at http://conditionalism.net/blog Related Posts “Punishment” and the Polysemy of Deverbal Nouns Consistency in Preterism: Annihilation and Revelation 20:10 Traditionalism and the (Not So) Second Death

Rethinking Hell contributor Dr. Glenn Peoples presents the positive case for annihilationism.   

Dr. John Stackhouse, Jr., Sangwoo Youtong Chee Professor of Theology and Culture at Regent College, Vancouver, Canada, joins RethinkingHell.com contributor Chris Date to discuss his story as a conditionalist and his lecture, “Hell and the Goodness of God.”   Promoted Resources John Stackhouse’s website Blog post containing link to recording of John’s lecture, “Hell and the Goodness of God” Regent College where John teaches

Part two of Chris Date’s discussion with Edward Fudge, author of The Fire That Consumes, who shares his story and talks about the recent movie that tells it, and about his latest and final book on the topic of final punishment, Hell: A Final Word. Also, we share the first installment of a segment telling the story of formerly convinced traditionalists who are now rethinking hell. Promoted Resources Hell: A Final Word, by Edward Fudge. Also available on Kindle. The third edition of Fudge’s The Fire That Consumes, also available on Kindle. “Hell and Mr. Fudge,” the recent movie telling his story. Edward Fudge’s website. Additional Links “How I Became a Conditionalist,” by John Roller (http://rethinkinghell.com/audio/John-Roller-How-I-Became-a-Conditionalist.mp3) Podcast Outline 00:46 Welcome 01:30 Episode 1 recap 01:52 Intro to episode 2 02:05 Start of Episode 2 02:15 Surprises that convinced Edawrd of Conditionalism 03:15 Edward Responds 03:53 Surprise #1: Conscious torment never pictured, but death 06:00 What a relief! The words mean what they say! 06:38 What a relief! The character of God remains intact 06:50 Personal Struggle (Ch. 45 of book) 07:10 Edward responds 10:05 Ch. 50: The Evangelical climate and a prediction about the future 10:20 Edward responds 13:31 Where is the debate headed? A new “traditional” view? 13:46 Edward Responds 14:20 Official view of the Church of England 15:47 Stackhouse mentioned (not by name, but as successor to Packer also unnamed) 16:12 Universalism the new debate that will be taken up 16:50 Diversity within Conditionalism 17:15 Edward Responds 18:26 Soteriology no impact on this view, unless devotion to creed demands it 19:00 annonymous example given where creedal commitment prevents a change of heart 20:38 Closing Question: Ch. 2 Edward had to share what he had found 21:40 What’s the best the opposition has to offer? 21:50 Edward Responds 25:33 Edward mentions Hell Under Fire (without naming it) as currently the best available 26:51 What encouragement for those feaful of fallout? 27:05 Edward: Biblical language at face value (no need to explain away plain wiords) 30:19 Last Question: What final word for those who aspire to carry the torch? 32:05 Edward’s story (had no idea the impact book would have, just committed work to God) 33:25 Being faitfhul with what we’ve been given the main point 34:00 Chris closes/transitions to Conditionalism Conversion story 35:08 John Roller’s story of conversion from traditionallism to conditionalism 44:53 Chris wraps up 45:16 Outro music

Edward Fudge, author of The Fire That Consumes, joins RethinkingHell.com contributor Chris Date to discuss his story, the recent movie that tells it, and his latest and final book on the topic of final punishment, Hell: A Final Word. Promoted Resources Hell: A Final Word, by Edward Fudge. Also available on Kindle. The third edition of Fudge’s The Fire That Consumes, also available on Kindle. “Hell and Mr. Fudge,” the recent movie telling his story. Edward Fudge’s website. Podcast Outline 00:00 Intro Music 01:30 Edward’s Recovery 03:25 Impact/Success of Edward’s book(s) 05:05 Hell and Mr. Fudge movie 07:50 Edward’s latest book: Hell A Final Word (main subject of interview) 08:10 Why this new book? 09:40 Ch. 3: Primer on Hell / 5 agreements with Traditionalists 12:35 Disagreements with Traditionalists 15:50 Ch. 4: Which Hell? Traditionalists ARE Rethinking Hell 19:30 Ch. 5 and Going beyond Exegesis (emotional and philosophical considerations) 25:13 Edward’s Story no stranger to controversey (Church of Christ fallout) 29:20 Ch. 12: Robert Brinsmead’s offer 34:20 A conference to (re)define Evangelicalism? 35:30 Surprising Truths (4 Pillars) 38:20 2nd Pillar: Intertestamental view toward ECT, solidified in NT? 40:30 3rd Pillar: Jesus the most to say about hell? (Die, Perish, Destroy) 43:15 4th Pillar: Immortal Soul 46:12 Chris closes and outro music